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Topic: The comings and goings of the European Union (Read 31026 times)

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
The comings and goings of the European Union
This thread is about new members entering (e.g. Croatia) and old members leaving (e.g. Britain) the Union, as well as other moves and changes in the European collective collective.

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #150
EU's final Copyright Reform upholds disastrous upload filters

The final text of Article 11 -- which has been the other major bone of contention -- also ended up being pretty much what opponents had feared, limiting the ability for any service to show snippets with links.

[...]

Parliament says Article 11 will allow hyperlinks to news articles to be accompanied by "individual words or very short extracts" without payments to rightsholders.
This seems to be about how search results would look like in a search engine. What a stupid thing to regulate. Even more, I think it is a stupid feature of the internet that there have to be search engines that display the results of *web crawlers* rather than what is really live on the internet. Web crawlers prioritise specific websites, say news portals, that they monitor constantly, so you get fresh stuff from those high-priority websites via search engine, while the search engine neglects other stuff. This has always been so, it is bad enough as it is, and it only makes it worse when regulators limit sharing content that is hard to get to in the first place.

The new regulation prevents displaying too much in the search engine, unless the search engine provider wants to "remunerate creators" even when "creators" have made it available to web crawlers. Probably Google's "cached" feature for pdf files in the search results will be gone - or gone for Europeans only. Total idiots at EU Commission.

But if the regulation is about more than just search results, if it's about, say, forum posts, twittering, news aggregators, then the EU Commission pretty much suppresses *sharing.* If so, the only safe place remains IRC. And darkweb.

The thing they should have done is to teach "creators" to not publish their stuff, to not make it available to web crawlers or other eyes on the internet. Don't "creators" have their own private/protected platforms where to share their stuff securely until their stuff becomes ready for publication? I have it (e.g. typing on my computer offline before I publish), so why don't they have it?

The final text of the Copyright Reform will now have to be approved by the Legal Affairs Committee, then voted on by member state governments in the European Council -- but it'll likely be passed there.
Oh, still another vote to go...

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #151
The UK is scheduled to leave the EU at 11pm local time on March 29 2019.
Oh no, this is not going according to schedule :(

  • Barulheira
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Schedules?!
Reply #152
The UK is scheduled to leave the EU at 11pm local time on March 29 2019.
Oh no, this is not going according to schedule :(
Oh, no! They are becoming Brazilian!

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #153
Breakthrough: UK and EU reach post-Brexit trade agreement
Just a week before the deadline, Britain and the European Union struck a free-trade deal Thursday that should avert economic chaos on New Year's and bring a measure of certainty for businesses after years of Brexit turmoil.
A week before the deadline? It always worked thus far to postpone all deadlines. It would have worked yet again as many times more. The negotiations were supposed to be over and out years ago.

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said: "It was a long and winding road, but we have got a good deal to show for it."

"It is fair, it is a balanced deal, and it is the right and responsible thing to do for both sides," she said in Brussels.
What does the EU have to show for the deal? The EU members lost fishing rights. UK will not be slapped with trade tariffs as any normal third-party country is. EU has removed BVI, SKN, ATG, CYM, and BMU from the list of tax haven countries in 2020, obviously giving in to UK, because all those countries are the worst tax havens by all measures.

The EU has long feared that Britain would slash social, environmental and state aid rules after Brexit and gain a competitive advantage over the EU. Britain denies planning to institute weaker standards but said that having to follow EU regulations would undermine its sovereignty.
And how will this agreement prevent it? As soon as UK notices that some of their goods will be examined in customs and their citizens cannot retire to Spain and Portugal without any obstacles anymore, they will start whining about their sovereignty yet again as if no relevant agreement had ever been negotiated. The only sovereignty UK is happy with is when nobody else has any sovereignty.

EU gained nothing. UK gained the same special treatment as when they were in EU. Maybe UK gained even better, because UK will push for own sovereignty (i.e. the right to interfere in the affairs of the continent) and EU will simply give in as always.

Johnson, who staked his career and reputation on extracting the country from the EU, said Britain will always be a strong friend and partner to the bloc.

"Although we have left the EU, this country will remain, culturally, emotionally, historically, strategically, geologically attached to Europe," he said.

  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #154
I mostly agree with your vision ersi, but bottom line to me is that the EU gained to get rid of the UK. The European project doesn't need traitors.

This deal is nothing, mainly about some minor fishing, nothing about finance or economics. A way to the UK government to make the British population believe they still have any negotiating power. They don't.

I have to salute the Scottish prime minister's words that they didn't vote nothing of this and this is the moment for Scotland to become an Independent European nation. Be welcome.
 
A matter of attitude.

  • Luxor
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #155
Scottish prime minister's

She's just called the First Minister, not PM.
The start and end to every story is the same. But what comes in between you have yourself to blame.

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #156
The increased political incentive for Scotland leaving the United Kingdom for the European Union is offset by the even stronger economic disincentive of a border between Scotland and England. In Northern Ireland the incentives go in the same direction. It makes more sense for Northern Ireland politically and economically to join Ireland (and the EU), though some will benefit from the current dual UK/EU regime.

Now, if Boris Johnson could follow through on his proposal to build that bridge from Scotland to Ireland there would be no reason for Scotland not to secede.


  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #157
She's just called the First Minister, not PM.
Gabh mo leisgeul
A matter of attitude.

  • Luxor
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #158
 :up:
The start and end to every story is the same. But what comes in between you have yourself to blame.

  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #159
For the detractors of the EU, the centralised vaccine acquisition process by Brussels for 27 countries was a fantastic thing allowing smaller countries to have the same negotiating power as the bigger ones.
Was not for that and people from Malta or Portugal or Estonia or many other nations would be vaccinated maybe by 2025.

A rare (very rare) example of the benefits of a centralised model of government, the same way the international co-operation between scientists was also a rare example of globalisation benefits.

Well, to Caesar what belongs to Caesar....
A matter of attitude.

  • rjhowie
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #160
I would remind you jax that Scotland is not a sound financial place whatsoever.  I am sure you do know that every year Scotland gets a very nice sum of money via the Barnett Formula and this tear got an even extra sum on top of that.  Without such would mean a dashed shortage of money. Even with that money given to Scotland by the GB Government  how would we properly exist? Indeed we also have the highest tax system of the 4 parts of Gt Britain thanks to to you know who.  As for throw in in that rather excellent idea of the PM regarding an Irish Sea crossover between Ulster and Scotland as a wonderful part of Irish unity, dear, oh dear. in passing I also hope that Salmond the ex-First Minister scuppers that mouthy wee Sturgeon.  :D
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #161
Yes, setting up barriers to trade with the larger economy comes at a significant economic cost, but citizens may still prefer it for sovereignty or something.

  • Luxor
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #162
Even with that money given to Scotland

Are you really going to start with this repetitive nonsense again?

We are given nothing, it's already our money, If anything it's the other way around. Why the hell do you think the rest of the UK want's to hold on to us? It's certainly not for our bloody charm. If we were subsidised by the rest of the UK we would have been jettisoned long before now. It would be a blessed relief for them to get rid of us moaning Scots and save some revenue for themselves.



The Barnett Formula Myth Destroyed - It does not subsidise Scotland

Quote
Arguably the most misunderstood part of the UK public sector budgeting mechanism is the Barnett Formula. The vast majority of people, politicians and the media seem to think that Barnett represents a subsidy to Scotland. Many Westminster MPs (mainly Conservatives) have described it as English taxpayers subsidising Scottish public spending, and the mainstream media have run headlines along those lines. There is just one little problem with that idea - it's complete and utter nonsense.
The start and end to every story is the same. But what comes in between you have yourself to blame.

  • rjhowie
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #163
<Repetitive nonsense removed.>

Moderator message: Once again you are just repeating everything you've been repeating for 7 years now. We're all fed up reading it. That means this thread and damn near every thread you post in. Take it elsewhere, it's not going to be tolerated here anymore. You have already been told about this, you're walking a very thin line now Rj.
  • Last Edit: 2021-01-31, 20:51:04 by Luxor
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #164
Russia humiliates Borrell in Moscow

In hindsight I can somewhat forgive to Merkel and Hollande when they sucked up to Putin some ten plus years ago. It was still stupid and dangerous to suck up to Putin, but times looked bright, particularly in the Western Europe, so their ignorance was somewhat understandable.

But Borrell's behaviour is dangerous and absolutely unforgivable. He is straightforwardly treasonous, because everybody should understand that this is a time of near-war wrt Russia. In order to restore the credibility of the EU, Borrell must be deposed swiftly.

  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #165
I wonder what Germany, Poland and Swede are waiting for deporting Russian Ambassadors as a reciprocity measure. This is in the first place a problem with those countries, the EU as a common organization should be supporting its members, not sending an idiot to Moscow.
A matter of attitude.

  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #166
Berlin, Warsow and Stockholm announced the expulsion of Russian diplomats as retaliation .
That's better.
A matter of attitude.

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #167
For the detractors of the EU, the centralised vaccine acquisition process by Brussels for 27 countries was a fantastic thing allowing smaller countries to have the same negotiating power as the bigger ones.
Was not for that and people from Malta or Portugal or Estonia or many other nations would be vaccinated maybe by 2025.

A rare (very rare) example of the benefits of a centralised model of government, the same way the international co-operation between scientists was also a rare example of globalisation benefits.

Well, to Caesar what belongs to Caesar....

Highest marks I would give to the EU for being instrumental in setting up COVAX. Belatedly, from 21 January this year, the US joined as well. China joined a few months before that. Russia hasn't, their official position may be described as COVAX neutral. COVAX is a reasonably enlightened global initiative, between vaccine nationalism and pure altruism. "Everyone gets, but I am first in line, because it's my party."

Now, at the point of highest demand and lowest supply, those good intentions are strained. Rich countries are not happy, and poor countries aren't getting it, and they need it. Add to that the long-running debate on intellectual property on medicine, regional and global rivalries between major powers, propaganda wars, and that this is D-day for anti-vaxxers everywhere, the noise level is high.

https://youtu.be/JV9lZjyn_to


  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #168
"Everyone gets, but I am first in line,
Why I don't get surprised with Israel and GB to be the two with biggest percentage of people already vaccinated?
  • Last Edit: 2021-02-11, 12:23:46 by Belfrager
A matter of attitude.

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #169
Could the EU save the Baltic nations from Russian military?



The short answer: No. The longer answer (spoiling the video): EU cannot muster the unity and efficiency needed, therefore the Baltic countries would be lost, but since Russia would likely lose Kaliningrad in the process, an attack is not expected.

Well, I agree. The EU is a scam in many ways, most lucidly when it comes to its foreign policy which does not exist. The kind of flip-flopping that we have seen with regard to Russia has done irreparable damage to security at the Eastern border of the EU, encouraging Putin's finger-itch as the western member states of the EU keep demonstrating that they do not have interests with the eastern member states.

And no, I don't think the EU needs an army. Nato will be good enough, if we kick USA out of it. We should have used the good opportunity when Trump was the president.

In other news, Denmark's Secret Service betrayed EU internet users to NSA (as already earlier revealed by Snowden, except for the nuance that NSA apparently obtained the data officially via a weak link among EU members) https://thehackernews.com/2021/06/report-danish-secret-service-helped-nsa.html
  • Last Edit: 2021-06-01, 19:24:40 by ersi

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #170
NATO, with respect to the Baltic States, is in defense of the indefensible. NATO is significantly stronger than Russia everywhere in its territory, except for the Baltic States. So if Russia wanted to harm NATO for the sake of harming NATO, the Baltic States would be the place to go. A small area, a small population, with little defensive terrain. easily isolated by the Suwalki gap and the Gulf of Finland (the Suwalki gap has replaced the Fulda gap in NATO parlance).

have no idea why you mix in EU into this. The EU member countries are the NATO member countries plus Ireland, Austria, Sweden and Finland, but minus Norway, Turkey, USA, Canada, and recently UK. Not what you usually would consider a good swap, though relevant for the Baltic. After all the EU has succeeded where Sweden failed miserably in their great power years, taking control of the Baltic Sea.

Not only Russia's Near Abroad. The Baltic Sea is kind of the EU Mare Nostrum.


The main risk is that in case of a Baltic invasion or incursion the NATO/EU countries won't come from "EU disunity", but from a Russian belief, warranted or not, that the US (or France or Britain) wouldn't go to full thermonuclear war to intercede in a "quarrel in  far away [countries}, between people of whom we know nothing" populated by six million people in total. Worst case the Russian leadership would believe NATO wouldn't while they actually would. In a full war with NATO Russia loses. Anything less than that and Russia (if not Russians) could win.

But in one regard EU is relevant. Military powerful NATO members are not in the EU, but Sweden and Finland are in the EU and not in NATO. In a Baltic conflict, we'd be busy trying to postpone defeat, but assuming this wouldn't happen, Sweden and Finland would be useful forward bases on attacks on Russia itself. Not merely on Königsberg, but also recognise the liberated Republic of Karelia, foment a new Russian revolution in Petrograd, liberate Belarus, free Siberia. None of these might happen, all of these would bother Moscow greatly. Russia in turn might feel more comfortable around the Black Sea, even with all the oligarch dachas there obliterated.

Assuming a Western commitment to the Baltic State and a willingness to do to Russia what Russia has been doing to them, little green men in the Baltics wouldn't be a winning move. That's what the EU might accomplish, making that commitment believable.

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #171
(I) have no idea why you mix in EU into this.
Surely you have some idea.

But in one regard EU is relevant.
See, you have some idea :)

Currently the most urgent point is how Denmark's Secret Service betrayed the entire EU with their machinations with USA's NSA, indicating a principled lack of commitment on security cooperation within the EU. You might say that this betrayal was towards USA, so it is less serious than if it had happened towards Russia, but it is evidence of how easy the EU is to pick apart on any issue, something that has been accomplished on a number of occasions both by USA and Russia.

At the current stage, some affected countries have individually expressed their disappointment at Denmark. Let's see if it escalates to the EU level.

  • jax
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  • Global Moderator
Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #172
I wouldn't automatically trust the French to come to the aid of the Baltics in every possible situation. For them there are bigger fishes in bigger seas.

A little more complicated...

That's a fair assessment, as in the map above. However like @Frenzie mentioned it gets more complicated yet with Cyprus and our Middle Sea, the 3C biggie, including the part you refer to as the Middle East. Turkey's interests don't align closely with the EU's, nor with Russia's.


Not to speak of the even bigger picture,


NATO/E3 have potential weaknesses too. The British ruling elite might live fat off Russian oligarch money, the Americans might elect another Russian puppet. Canada might be concerned about their Russian neighbour, but be unable to project that concern.

All this bother and worry notwithstanding, a Baltic gambit would be a long-term losing move for Moscow. It could be a short-term bet, and that would be a problem, not the least for those living around it.

Currently the most urgent point is how Denmark's Secret Service betrayed the entire EU with their machinations with USA's NSA, indicating a principled lack of commitment on security cooperation within the EU. You might say that this betrayal was towards USA, so it is less serious than if it had happened towards Russia, but it is evidence of how easy the EU is to pick apart on any issue, something that has been accomplished on a number of occasions both by USA and Russia.

At the current stage, some affected countries have individually expressed their disappointment at Denmark. Let's see if it escalates to the EU level.

This is late NSA fallout. To reconstruct the timeline:

1952: NSA was born. Like the CIA it was a continuation of offices running intelligence during WWII, with NSA signals intelligence.
1969: The internet was born. 1971 email. 1973 first connection outside USA (to Norway and UK). 1980 Usenet. 1989 WWW.
Mass communication meet mass (signals) surveillance. It's been a 50 years battle so far between those who want privacy and security, those who want to eavesdrop, those who want to make money, and those who like to watch a video of their nephew. Suffice to say, the eavesdroppers won most of the battles.
In part because people in positions of power tend to worry about them more than they worry about us, and because there is more money and success to be had by not worrying. We are having this discussion on Facebook after all.
2005: General Keith Alexander became director of the NSA, at a time where covert global surveillance became a technical possibility. NSA were the first, but are no longer the only.
2013: Edward Snowden took a trip to Hong Kong
2014: The head of Danish Defense Intelligence Service (DDIS) took note of that recent refugee and started a secret internal investigation ("Operation Dunhammer") to uncover if Danish communication cables had been part of NSA operations, and against whom.
2015: The reports says "Yup", and names names. He tells his new boss, and the buck (assumedly) stops there. Notably they neglect to tell the Intelligence Oversight (TET) committee.
2018: A whistle-blower fixes that Oversight oversight and handles over a cache of documents. TET start an investigation of their own.
2020: TET delivers a massive and crushing report of the DDIS and a press conference, "historic scandal". Five bosses are fired, including the two above. The government gives itself a year to investigate the investigation of the investigation of the NSA leak.
2021: The investigation of the investigation of the investigation of the leak is leaked.

Presumably the NSA has learned and is a little more circumspect and careful in their global surveillance now, but we also got more actors.

It highlights the umbrella problem. Currently we use the American umbrella, and are a part of that platform and that includes being their eyes and ears.  French presidents since forever and to forever want us to use their umbrella. Apart from this being an inferior umbrella, it would entail buying into their post-colonial foreign policies. We might be headed that way anyway.

  • Belfrager
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #173
Does the Baltic states have any better solution to face Putin than to integrate EU and Nato?
Fear not.
A matter of attitude.

  • ersi
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Re: The comings and goings of the European Union
Reply #174
There is only one option: Union. Either European Union or something like Soviet Union.