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Topic: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland? (Read 89614 times)

  • jax
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What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
So what is happening in those barely populated areas linked to the North Atlantic ocean?

  • jax
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #400
I thought the same thing, it got dark earlier than expected. That might be the camera, or astronomical/timezone phenomena. The Earth's orbit isn't a perfect circle, which means that the sun appears to move at slightly different speed, while the day is defined by average speed. By summertime solar noon, the meridian is after noon. Also each hourly time zone is 30° wide, which takes the sun one hour to pass, and European Central Time is wider still. 



Add to that summer time and sunset/sunrise is no longer symmetric around midnight. Oslo is 11°E, Stockholm is 18°E and Helsinki 25°E, but in a different time zone. So the meridian in Oslo is 13:16, in Stockholm 12:47, and in Helsinki 13:19.

Actually by now there is no night, but three hours of civil twilight and two of nautical twilight. 



  • Barulheira
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Hourly time zone
Reply #401
 :sst: I'm afraid each hourly time zone is 15° wide. (360°/24h)

  • jax
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #402
That, fortunately, makes more sense. Central European Time is a fairly wide zone, on the mainland the westernmost part of Spain is 9° west of Greenwich, while the easternmost part of Norway is 31° east (further east than Istanbul).

  • Belfrager
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #403
:sst:  I'm afraid each hourly time zone is 15° wide. (360°/24h)
Of course. Jax is entering into delirium. Administrative time zones aren't obviously solar hours.
A matter of attitude.

  • ersi
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #404
Vello Vaher goes America.

  • jax
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #405

  • jax
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #406
When in Northern Norway a couple weeks ago, I came across the oldest shop in the local region, some 180 years old.

What separates us from then isn't as much the shop, or the age (it's fairly old, but not exceptionally so), but the location, and the thinking that this is the natural place to set one up. 




  • Frenzie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #407
Is it a fishing supply store or some such?

  • jax
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #408
It was a "krambu" (general store) on top of a boathouse the would-be merchant bought. It is likely that fishing and farming equipment were among the products sold, but I don't know. This was not only before cars, but before roads as well, and the geography there is highly fractal,  so it made sense to have a "row-in" store.

  • Frenzie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #409
Sure, a bit like how the canals in Amsterdam and Venice make for very efficient transport ways, except natural. Still, it looks so remote. :P

  • Belfrager
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #410
It's obvious that the remote oh so romantic little shop lives from Norway's oil subsides. As everything else.
Maybe I should move to Norway, Norwegian Wood Beatle's song comes to mind. The only problem is that the very beautiful Norwegian girls once reach the thirties turns into huge fat whales. It must be from their food.
A matter of attitude.

  • rjhowie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #411
Not able to cuddle a woman and your hands reach each other? Hhhm, I would go somewhere else for a trip.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • ersi
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #412
@krake
You've demonstrated that there's no point reasoning with you. However, the matter is obviously close to my heart, so I will concisely state the other side, so to say, even if you are not listening.

Bear in mind that it makes no changes to the matter because my statement is still valid whereas yours are false to put it mildly...

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That preamble has drawn vituperations from Lavrov, his ministry's chief spokesman Alexander Yakovenko, the Duma's and Federation Council's foreign affairs committee chairmen Konstantin Kosachev and Mikhail Margelov, and other Moscow officials. Politically, they object to the Estonian parliament's references to the 1991 and 1992 documents that mention the "Soviet aggression against Estonia in 1940," "illegal annexation," and "decades of occupation." Those formulations are not included or cited in the Estonian parliament's June 20, 2005, document. But its mere reference to the earlier documents that include those formulations seems beyond official Moscow's capacity to come to terms with its history.
source

How many evidences like the above (written in English) do you still need? 1?, 5?, 10?, ...?
Or do you think all those articles have been written and published (that of the BBC included) by KGB agents?
The thing going on here is the usual anti-neighbour ramblings in Russian Duma. They do that a lot. They call current Germany fascists too, occasionally. Let's be charitable and say that ramblings in the Duma are not official stances of the country.

This is not to say that the ramblings have no reference to reality whatsoever. Indeed, Estonian parliament has adopted laws, declarations and other documents regarding the Soviet past. However, we have done this from day one in order to deal with the Soviet ballast that we have, guided by the constitution we readopted. This is comparable to the way Russia itself is dealing with its own Stalinist past.

The Russian Duma ramblings and "vituperations from Lavrov" gave the world the false impression as if Estonia began mentioning Soviet aggression specifically in connection with the border agreement and as if Estonia began busily changing the signed border agreement. You were clearly under this false impression. Still false impression. So, 12 points to Russian propaganda.

And since we are at it let me quote you:
You know wrong. Estonia and Latvia had territorial claims against Russia until Merkel forced us to renounce the claims. Meaning, "friendly fire" from within EU forced us to formally renounce claims to independence. Thank you very much!
Let's compare your statement with what BalticTimes has to say:
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As compared to 2005, the wording of the border agreements has remained unchanged
source

In 2005 Merkel wasn't in office and the border agreements have remained unchanged in 2014 compared to 2005.

So, who tells the true and who makes false allegations? BalticTimes? Ersi?
Let's elaborate a bit what I meant when I said "renounce claims to independence". I meant the reference to Treaty of Tartu in the preamble.

The reference to Treaty of Tartu in the preamble that you now have, says (after removing the distracting salad of legalese): "...keeping in mind that the current agreement changes the border defined by the Constitution and the Treaty of Tartu and does not change the rest of the Treaty..."

Why is this important? Because our Constitution § 122. says that the border of Estonia is defined by Treaty of Tartu. Thus, Treaty of Tartu is as foundational to Estonia's existence as our constitution and at least as important as recognitions of independence from our neighbours are. Granted, this puts Estonia quite fundamentally to a precarious situation vis-a-vis Russia, but, you see, these are our foundational documents readopted at 1992 referendum, so that's what we must stick to, if we are to remain ourselves. Otherwise we would get far worse disrespect internationally for publicly pissing on ourselves. Which we are getting as we speak. And living next to Russia is precarious no matter what you do or say. We live next to Russia, so we know. You don't.

Sidenote: Being me, when I contemplate the facts that

- the border agreement with Russia changes the borders of Treaty of Tartu
- Russia has not acknowledged the Treaty of Tartu

I would not have signed such an agreement. Things must go in their proper order. Either Russia acknowledges the Treaty of Tartu or we negotiate a new treaty with new borders to replace it, with full-blown reciprocal recognition of independence "perpetually" as those treaties normally state (yes, Treaty of Tartu says the equivalent of "perpetually" or "eternally"), and Estonia must have a referendum to alter the relevant point in the constitution. Then the signature and ratification would follow. That's backbone.

Unfortunately, we gave in to pressure from EU (specifically to Merkel's heated rush to get visa freedom with Russia), we renounced the reference to Treaty of Tartu while signing to change our borders. That's diplomatic suicide.

Besides dropping any reference to Treaty of Tartu, another detail that changed between 2005 and 2014 was the two sentences referenced in Baltic Times. The first says "the agreement regulates only issues concerning the state border" - meaning it is unconcerned with recognition of independence. The other "confirms reciprocally the lack of territorial claims." Namely, Russia considers upholding Treaty of Tartu as territorial claims agains Russia, so Estonia's signature now means, from Russia's point of view, that we have are giving it all up. Next, Russia invaded Crimea to show what gets done to the weak.


For those interested in the entire debate (such as myself in two years or so), the starting point is here https://thedndsanctuary.eu/index.php?topic=230.msg65379#msg65379
  • Last Edit: 2016-09-06, 06:09:02 by ersi

  • rjhowie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #413
Russia invaded Crimea? Dear, oh dear!
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • krake
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #414
Former NATO Chief Propagandist Anders Fogh Rasmussen is performing now his part outside the military alliance. :jester:
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The United States Must Be the World's Policeman
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NATO an US instrument for policing the world?
It's a new definition of NATO, A.F.Rasmussen is trying to coin.

  • rjhowie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #415
Instead of acting as if it had some inherent right to be the world's policeman with it's own unsavoury record it needs a new Revolution but by the people not the rich.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • krake
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #416
Finland schools: Subjects scrapped and replaced with 'topics' as country reforms its education system

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Subject-specific lessons - an hour of history in the morning, an hour of geography in the afternoon - are already being phased out for 16-year-olds in the city's upper schools. They are being replaced by what the Finns call "phenomenon" teaching - or teaching by topic. For instance, a teenager studying a vocational course might take "cafeteria services" lessons, which would include elements of maths, languages (to help serve foreign customers), writing skills and communication skills.

No math classes, no chemistry classes - let's mix them up and play cafeteria instead. :)

  • Belfrager
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #417
We need a Finland poster...
A matter of attitude.

  • OakdaleFTL
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #418
ersi lives next door. You could ask him... :)
进行 ...
"Humor is emotional chaos remembered in tranquility." - James Thurber
No one listens to me as much as I do and even I have my limits...
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts!" - Richard Feynman

  • ersi
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #419
Finland schools: Subjects scrapped and replaced with 'topics' as country reforms its education system
It's too much to say "reform" about it. It's just an experiment in select schools. If it works, it will be expanded maybe. If it won't work, it will be scrapped.

Another avant-guard experiment I remember from Finland in late 80's was to mix different age groups together, to inject something called variety in the teaching process. Predictably, mess ensued. Bullying increased - a few naughty older boys easily commanded the entire classroom and there was no restraining them. Teachers didn't know what to teach in terms of age-appropriateness and correspondence to curriculum. The experiment was scrapped.

Experiments like this are just frustration to teachers, if the entire teaching process is not given to them. But when teachers of the local school get to decide everything, then schools are not the same over the country and everybody is not getting the same education, but getting the same education everywhere is the point of the tax-funded public school system. Therefore I maintain that the classical traditional didactics is not just classical and traditional - it's also best tested and in practice the only workable way. If the reformers knew it from the inside well enough, they would also know its flexibility.

When will they experiment with a school without teachers? Hah.

The article says, "...education to  promote character, resilience and communication skills, rather than just pushing children through "exam factories"." The education system of Japan has always been an outright exam hell, but always measured well in international ranking. Currently, China is on the rise, another pure exam hell. And I'd like to see how one practically detaches character, resilience and communication skills from grades and exams so that the said skills become measurably improved.


  • Frenzie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #420
Incidentally, you might be interested in the first nine minutes or so of this video (start at 28s). Admittedly it's in the UK, not Finland.

https://youtu.be/is31rrXubQ0?t=28s

  • Mr. Tennessee
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #421
I did it for 30 years. Students wanted to be in my classes, and parents wanted their children in my classes. That was in the good old days.

  • rjhowie
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #422
Ah-ha, a very subtle change of name label but known dear man. Good for you and can note the support as I got the same in my job involving the young and my voluntary side.  Always extra nice when i sometimes bump into those I knew a while ago and the face lights up when they see me.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

  • krake
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #423
Estonia Navy Chief Resigns Over Contraband Smuggling Scandal
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The commander of the Estonia Navy has resigned after customs officials said they found smuggled alcohol and cigarettes aboard an Estonian ship taking part in NATO operations on the Baltic Sea.

  • Belfrager
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Re: What's going on in Scandinavia, North Atlantic, Baltic States and Scotland?
Reply #424
Any chance the Estonian Captain being Captain Haddock? :)

I don't understand how a war vessel can be searched by customs officials.
A matter of attitude.